Millennial Essentials What They Want, What They’ll Pay For, and How to Give It to Them

00:00:01:19 - 00:00:21:12
Sara Gutterman: For being here with us today for the webinar Millennial Essentials What They want, what They'll pay for and how to give it to them. I'm Sarah Gutman, I am the CEO of Green Builder Media. And for those of you who regularly attend our webinars, you are used to our moderator, Mike Collignon, who, alas, is not here with us today.

00:00:21:14 - 00:00:43:04
Sara Gutterman: It's always a loss when we have to do a webinar without him, but he is getting ready for the next generation water summit, which is occurring tomorrow and the next day. So for if for any of you who are interested in learning more about water solutions, I think most of you know water is one of the most important topics of our moment.

00:00:43:05 - 00:01:07:26
Sara Gutterman: I encourage you to attend and check out the Next Generation Water Summit. You can just google it and find the URL online. It's always a great event. If you can't make it over the next couple of days. They do record those sessions and you can listen listen to those until the end of June. But today, for the task at hand, we're really excited to talk with you about millennials.

00:01:07:26 - 00:01:48:19
Sara Gutterman: I think we all know that over the last two ish years, millennials have seized the top influencer position in the housing market, spending more money on buying and remodeling homes than any other audience segment and green builder media with our cognition, Smart Data market intelligence and data service has delved very deeply and very vertically into this audience segment, collecting data on their preferences, their purchase drivers, their behavioral patterns, their perceptions, perceptions, and really, you know, just developed a comprehensive understanding of what they like, what they want and what they're looking for.

00:01:48:19 - 00:02:18:07
Sara Gutterman: And we look forward to sharing some of those insights, as well as some breaking survey information and data that we have just collected. Hot Off the press is you're the first to hear about that today. We're also excited to talk with you about our revision House Austin project as a use case. That was a demonstration project that we did with a millennial influencer in conjunction with these wonderful companies that I have listed on the screen.

00:02:18:07 - 00:03:08:05
Sara Gutterman: So a warm welcome to our partners in that project that include LG, a variety of the LG divisions, including their appliance division and particularly their signature signature kitchen suite or SCS line of products, the LG vac division, as well as the LG Solar Division and LCS houses, which is their countertop division. We also had the good fortune to work with companies like Mohawk on Flooring Lift Master on their Mike Hugh Garage systems, green Fiber on their high performance insulation, bocce on their beautiful and sustainable farmhouse sinks, HP products on their central VAX systems, and Hayward on their high performance pool system.

00:03:08:05 - 00:03:36:11
Sara Gutterman: So lots of great products and and technologies and solutions that we'll talk about later in the context of the revision house. Austin. Within the context of understanding how to deliver what millennials are looking for. So with that, I'm going to dive into the profile of the millennial audience and give some insights about what they tell us, not just what they want, but actually what they will pay for.

00:03:36:11 - 00:04:19:00
Sara Gutterman: And by the way, all of the data that I'll be presenting in this presentation has been harvested and gleaned by our cognition smart data division. And just so you know, we poured in a couple of different data sets into cognition. The first is a proprietary artificial intelligence based technology platform that minds web and social media content using contextual filters to look at those things like behavior sentiment preferences, using Watson logic, and specifically focused on areas that are important to us like net zero electrification, healthy living, smart home, etc. we also, of course, port in our deep vertical audience data.

00:04:19:00 - 00:04:46:21
Sara Gutterman: We reach millions of early adopter and first mover consumers. So when I show a chart or a graph with millennial data, just know that it does come from that early adopter and first mover segment. And then we also do port in market growth data in kind of regional markets across the country. So just giving that a some context in the background for the data that I will be providing to you today, I'm going to go ahead and dive in.

00:04:46:21 - 00:05:20:11
Sara Gutterman: So as I mentioned, millennials and older Gen Z are the top influencers in today's housing market. They are now about 50% of all home buyers and about 78% of new home buyers. They're very bullish about buying homes because they view homeownership as a way to achieve financial security and just a stable lifestyle, and they really understand that they can grow wealth and value through home ownership.

00:05:20:11 - 00:05:45:10
Sara Gutterman: And they look at homes as an appreciable asset, probably more so than older generations did at when they were that age. And part of the way that we know that and we assess that is because and I have some data on this on a later slide, but millennials are staying in their homes longer, if you remember, you know, homeowners used to stay in their homes somewhere between 5 to 7 years.

00:05:45:11 - 00:06:05:11
Sara Gutterman: And it became, you know, kind of seven to maybe eight years. We used to hear about the seven year flip, but now millennials are staying in their homes or at least planning to stay in their homes, you know, 10 to 15 years. And actually, again, I've got data later that shows that about 15% of millennials say that they are in their forever home.

00:06:05:11 - 00:06:31:18
Sara Gutterman: So it's a much longer term value proposition. And because of that, they're more willing to make investments in their homes that will help save them money in the long term and improve their value in the long term. The average profile of a millennial homebuyer is a dual income, college educated couple that you know is starting or has already started a young family.

00:06:31:18 - 00:06:58:21
Sara Gutterman: They want more space. They're totally at home in the digital world, so they're comfortable buying products from their home. They're comfortable connecting with builders and contractors and designers online, and they're also even comfortable buying homes fully online, or at least having the majority of their home buying experience online. This is a very values based and mission driven audience segment.

00:06:58:21 - 00:07:23:17
Sara Gutterman: They're also the largest generation in the workforce. They're going to comprise about 75% of the workforce by 2025, which is tomorrow. Another important thing to note is that they have more spending power now than any other generation, at about 1.4 trillion per year, and they are on the receiving end of tens of trillions of dollars in inheritance from their grandparents and their parents.

00:07:23:17 - 00:07:50:19
Sara Gutterman: And that wealth transfer is already happening. Now, this is an audience segment that's very comfortable with remote working. In fact, many of them have worked remotely for most or all of their careers. They're really thriving in this remote work environment. And as I mentioned, their values based and mission driven. They value happiness. They value protecting the environment and health and wellness, and they want to contribute to social purpose.

00:07:50:21 - 00:08:21:06
Sara Gutterman: They value deep relationships, and they do really prioritize purpose over paycheck. We saw that a bit in the Great Resignation over the last couple of years, where a lot of the millennials that did leave the corporate workforce decided to start their own businesses or decided to join other organizations that were more aligned with their values. Sustainability is of paramount importance to this audience.

00:08:21:06 - 00:08:51:14
Sara Gutterman: In fact, you can see some recent survey results here that show that 96% of respondents say that sustainability is, you know, extremely important, very important, or at least important when making purchasing decisions in general. That's not only for homes or products for their homes, but it's just in general. 77% of millennials report that they're willing to pay more for environmentally sustainable products, and almost 80% are concerned about the environmental impact of the products they buy.

00:08:51:14 - 00:09:26:29
Sara Gutterman: And that's at least 10 to 15 and in some cases, 20 basis points higher than older generations than Xers and Boomers. And here's a really important point of reference. You can see almost 50% of our millennial survey respondents. Again, early adopters and first movers tell us that corporate sustainability, ESG practices, carbon footprint and environmental product declarations, or ePDM are the number one consideration when selecting products for their homes.

00:09:26:29 - 00:09:47:18
Sara Gutterman: And we've been serving our consumer audience for about 17 years since our inception. This is the first time over the and this is not just a one survey outlier response. This is actually a question that we've been asking ongoing for about two years. This has been the answer. So we know it's not an outlier. We know it's a legit answer.

00:09:47:18 - 00:10:23:06
Sara Gutterman: And this this particular priority keeps growing in importance. First it was 30%, then was 40%. Now it's almost 50%. So we say that you know for any if you're a building professional, if you are a manufacturer pay attention to this. It's not a trend. It's really a value and inherent value and one that, you know, we should all be paying attention to because the companies that don't that haven't already started their ESG strategies and journey are already behind the ball.

00:10:23:13 - 00:10:51:23
Sara Gutterman: They're already, you know, they the train has left the station and and you know, they've already missed that one. So there's enough time to to run and hop back on it. But but that that movement is, is is growing in momentum. And very quickly when we look at top of mind topics for millennials, an all time high of about 87% are worried about climate change in the environment.

00:10:51:23 - 00:11:25:23
Sara Gutterman: And this is not. Oh yes, I'm aware that climate change is here irrespective of how it's happening. 93% again, of our survey, respondents believe that companies should take a stand on environmental issues. Again, that plays into that, those ESG strategies. And for anyone that's not familiar with ESG, environmental, social and governance strategies for corporations, excuse me, governance strategies, you know, almost 80% prefer purchasing products from sustainable brands.

00:11:25:23 - 00:11:50:06
Sara Gutterman: But here's where it gets a little scary. 77% of millennials consider the future to be frightening, and 56% think that humanity is doomed because of climate change. Those aren't small numbers. That's not like, oh, 7% of millennials think humanity is doomed. I mean, this is a majority of survey respondents, and this is making millennials feel afraid and sad and anxious.

00:11:50:07 - 00:12:24:00
Sara Gutterman: You know, we hear a lot about how our kids are not okay. And when I see news stories, a lot of times I'll see those news stories about kids in high school or even younger. But this this is, you know, pervasive, you know, I would probably say across all generations, but even into that millennial audience, which is, you know, 25 to early 40s, you know, there is a sense of powerlessness, you know, based on what's happening in the climate and in the world.

00:12:24:02 - 00:12:48:27
Sara Gutterman: And that's obviously affecting both physical and mental health, which is also top of mind for this audience segment. They like telemedicine, probably not surprisingly, because they are digital natives. They like the convenience of, you know, having all things online. And then, you know, the other thing that is top of mind from them, of course, for them, of course, is financial stability.

00:12:48:29 - 00:13:25:11
Sara Gutterman: And it's a lot of this has to do with debt that's been incurred from college and credit cards, as they have embarked on life and careers and having young families. And so, you know, these are some of the top of mind topics you can see here. Again, this is recent survey data that the top global risk of highest concern to millennials is the failure to mitigate and attack the climate change more so than grown a virus, more so than financial concerns or social instability or gun violence or terrorist activity.

00:13:25:14 - 00:13:51:07
Sara Gutterman: Interestingly, to me, the water crisis is still pretty small. If if it were up to me, I'd like to actually see that number relating to water be much bigger because as I mentioned earlier, it's such an important topic and it's a crisis moment for us. Maybe folks are including drought, you know, or let's say too much and too little water into that top line failure to mitigate and adapt to climate change.

00:13:51:07 - 00:14:43:04
Sara Gutterman: But, you know, you can see here that clearly, you know, they care deeply about climate change. They're worried about the future and they're making decisions accordingly. And perhaps the reason why their they care so deeply about climate change is because they're being affected by it. So you can see in the chart on the left, when we ask our millennial audience which types of climate events or natural events they're being affected by, you can see it's hurricanes, tornadoes, extreme temperatures, wildfires, droughts, flooding, sea, sea level rise, etc. and, you know, some of these natural events, we can, let's say, plan for and incorporate building solutions for in a more kind of comprehensive and effective way.

00:14:43:07 - 00:15:14:15
Sara Gutterman: Others are a little bit harder to to kind of build and plan for. But certainly, you know, resiliency is top of mind. You can see in the chart on the right. This is a kind of generational breakdown of how the different generations view resiliency in terms of priority. And that turquoise is represents millennials. So clearly this is top of mind to millennials way more so than other generations.

00:15:14:15 - 00:15:50:25
Sara Gutterman: And what the way that we're seeing that translate into the home buying and home selling market is that resiliency is absolutely driving homeowner home buyer home selling decisions. As these extreme weather events continue to increase in frequency as insurance providers sees coverage in areas that are prone to wildfires and hurricanes and sea level rise, etc.. And, you know, we're starting to see buyers at least request and in some cases require certain resiliency elements.

00:15:50:25 - 00:16:30:05
Sara Gutterman: We're also seeing sellers making investments to enhance the resiliency in order to kind of appeal to those savvier buyers. But then the other part of this is we are starting to see ratcheted codes that are responding to the increasing frequency and intensity of of these climate events or natural events that I really believe is going to change the way we are designing and building homes and buildings in the future, especially as we see communities rebuilding.

00:16:30:06 - 00:16:50:14
Sara Gutterman: You know, the second or the third or the fourth time after a wildfire or after a flood, you know, how how many times do you have to see your home and your community be affected by one of these events before your heart is totally broken, either as a homeowner, a code official, or, you know, as a, you know, an elected official.

00:16:50:18 - 00:17:21:10
Sara Gutterman: And at what point, how many times is your community have to burn down before you say enough is enough? And either you're changing the way that you construct or you leave that area entirely. And we're actually starting to see those decisions happening. We already started seeing that, you know, over the last couple of years where, you know, governments in new Jersey are now trying to buy homes from homeowners, you know, along the Jersey shore to prevent, you know, just, you know, impact from super storms.

00:17:21:15 - 00:17:46:13
Sara Gutterman: And I think we're going to start seeing that in really Florida and up along the eastern seaboard and along the southern coast of the country as well, perhaps in California and other fire prone areas too. But back to millennials, I digress. So what are millennials looking for in terms of homes? I like to say they're really looking for the sustainability unicorn, right?

00:17:46:13 - 00:18:15:03
Sara Gutterman: They want it all. They want homes that are net zero all electric, healthy, resilient, connected and solar powered with storage. They want resilient homes, and resiliency to them partly means being able to generate their own power. But it also partly means being able to generate their own food as well. And so you'll see later we have some outdoor living trends that, you know, there's a lot of interest in onsite food productions.

00:18:15:03 - 00:18:52:06
Sara Gutterman: But what we are also seeing, and I alluded this to this little earlier, that because millennials have this longer term view of home ownership and it's just not an asset to just be flipped in seven years, they are starting to facilitate a shift in the valuation metric for homes looking beyond that lowest upfront cost to a different metric that actually incorporates energy efficiency and resiliency, indoor air quality and healthy home aspects, and really reflects long term home ownership value and full cost rather than just out front post.

00:18:52:09 - 00:19:10:14
Sara Gutterman: So as you can see here, when we ask about, you know, kind of top priority home topics, a lot of these sustainability elements are, you know, right up on the top of mind and the top of the list for millennials with healthy home and resiliency. Again, really, you know, kind of leading the charge. Smart home is, you know right after that.

00:19:10:14 - 00:19:39:28
Sara Gutterman: And then net zero and energy efficiency follow suit as well. Another really interesting note to point out in our survey data over the last year and a half, for the first time ever, our consumer audience again consisting primarily of millennials in these surveys, when we pull out that millennial data, they tell us that having a healthy home is as important as location when making home buying decisions.

00:19:39:28 - 00:20:04:20
Sara Gutterman: And that's never happened. It's always been location. But now healthy home is right up there. So again, just showing the importance of that. You know, clearly Healthy Home was the belle of the ball with respect to Covid. It really brought healthy home and indoor air quality to the forefront of our national dialog. When we ask millennials how Covid has changed their behavior, they're exercising more.

00:20:04:22 - 00:20:27:01
Sara Gutterman: They're more aware of their indoor air quality and their energy efficiency. They're investing in smart home technologies. They're growing their own food. They're working from home. None of these are big surprises. But, you know, the data really shows that we actually know what we know. We don't just think we know. Now, when we get to some of these upgrades that millennials tell us that they will pay for.

00:20:27:03 - 00:21:03:25
Sara Gutterman: You can see the the code on the or the key on the bottom right where the yellow color is, that it indicates areas where millennials tell us that they'll spend more than $10,000. The green shows us where millennials say they'll spend between about 5000 to 10,000, and the red shows where they will pay between 1000 and 5000. So as you can see, you know, energy efficiency is the area that our millennials, the most millennials, say they'll spend between 1000 to 5000.

00:21:03:28 - 00:21:32:02
Sara Gutterman: You know, healthy home is the area where they'll spend, you know, more than 10,000. Again, it's still small numbers, though. Only 11% of millennials say they would spend more than 10,000. But in that healthy home category, you know, 35% say they'll spend between 5000 and 10,040% say between 1000 and 5000. Nearly 60% of millennials say they'll spend between 1 to 5000 on energy efficiency.

00:21:32:04 - 00:22:01:23
Sara Gutterman: You can also see that smart home technology is important, with about 38%, they'll spend between 5 to 10,044% between 1 to 5000. And then just some other things of note. You can see that, you know, water conservation. About 50% say they'll spend between 1 to 5000. Over 50% say they'll spend that much on resiliency, as well as solar plus storage and enhanced outdoor living.

00:22:01:23 - 00:22:31:25
Sara Gutterman: But then, surprisingly, you know, out of all the things we asked them what they would spend on, about 50% said that they would spend between 1 to 5000 on net zero carbon getting their home to net zero carbon. So clearly that's rising in interest. Now, when we asked about specific upgrades that millennials will pay for, again, you know, the the areas where millennials say they would pay over 10,000, it's still pretty small.

00:22:31:25 - 00:23:00:08
Sara Gutterman: And I would say in general, you know, it kind of ranged from about 2% to maybe up to about 8%. So 8% of millennials say that they would spend over 10,000 for high performance HVAC systems and integrated smart home systems. But, you know, certainly about 50% say that they would pay, you know, 40 to 50% would pay 1 to 5000 for things like heat pump water heaters.

00:23:00:11 - 00:23:53:22
Sara Gutterman: So solar photovoltaic, proactive indoor air quality systems, smart thermostats, high performance windows and insulation. And about 50% say they would pay between 1 to 5% for energy efficient appliances. So, you know, clearly there's awareness and, you know, interest in investing in some of these elements. And then you can see here we also asked about rating systems. I think you know, the things the numbers just to point out the highest numbers, about 40% of millennials said that they would pay between 1 to 5%, excuse me, 1000 to 5000 for passive house certification, Hers ratings, indoor Air Plus and Water sense.

00:23:53:25 - 00:24:25:10
Sara Gutterman: Now when we look at and this is a little bit more anecdotal, when we look at the energy efficiency upgrades that really seem to make sense for millennials, that they say they will pay for and then actually do pay for is, you know, just the low hanging fruit ones, right? HVAC, insulation, windows, appliances, solar panels, heat pump technologies those are really the ones that stand out to be, you know, kind of the the low hanging fruit upgrades.

00:24:25:12 - 00:24:54:25
Sara Gutterman: When we look at the healthy home upgrades that millennials are willing to spend on, the first kind of the the area that they're willing to spend the most on R is on indoor air monitors, right. They they really want to see and be able to measure the VOCs and toxins in their air. They also will spend money on air purification systems and fresh air exchange systems, including EVs.

00:24:54:28 - 00:25:25:10
Sara Gutterman: Now, when we just talk about general preferred home features, millennials like garages. But interestingly, they don't want garages for vehicles. They more often than not. Believe it or not, want garages for alternative uses like home gyms or office spaces or, you know, just hobby areas or gathering spaces. Probably not surprisingly, they're really, you know, looking for yards and gardens.

00:25:25:10 - 00:25:47:13
Sara Gutterman: I mentioned food production and outdoor decks for just hanging out and working and entertaining. And then of course, they want, you know, larger kitchens and home gyms and exercise rooms. They really want to connect with nature. So, you know, living in a home with a larger yard and more living space is important. They and this is more kind of home aspirations.

00:25:47:13 - 00:26:17:23
Sara Gutterman: What are the things that they really want. They do want those home gyms, bigger homes. But we have some data on the home size. When we say bigger homes, it's maybe moving from a, you know, 500 to 1000 square foot apartment to a 1200 square foot homes. We are not talking McMansions here. When we look at outdoor living trends, you know, the millennials tell us they're using their outdoor living spaces 4 to 6 times a week.

00:26:17:25 - 00:26:46:05
Sara Gutterman: And the most important elements to them are growing their own food and then having those garden beds. So clearly, you know, having kind of the drought tolerant elements and then being able to, to grow their own food is of paramount importance. You can see here just a little bit more information on, you know, what's most important when they're planning their spaces and then how they're actually using their outdoor spaces.

00:26:46:08 - 00:27:13:05
Sara Gutterman: Now finally, just a few more slides to kind of give some some more context about what millennials are thinking and what they're looking for. So, you know, in general, millennials tell us that they do want new homes. But as you can see, about 82% of younger millennials and 71% of older millennials tell us that they have had to make budget driven decisions to actually purchase existing homes and older homes.

00:27:13:07 - 00:27:36:22
Sara Gutterman: You can also see kind of the median home sale price, and this is from several months ago. So this may have changed a little bit. But you know, it's around 250 with the younger millennials who are maybe earlier on in their careers, you know, more inclined to purchase homes in the 2 to 250 range. Whereas older millennials who are more established and have safer down payment might be in that.

00:27:36:22 - 00:28:03:03
Sara Gutterman: Three 5450 even up to, you know, five 5650 and you can see, you know, about 70% of millennials put less than 20% down when purchasing homes. And then here's the data I alluded to earlier that millennials plan to stay in their homes about ten years, that actually that number is increasing. It's growing. It's already we've seen now that some some millennials are staying up to 15 years.

00:28:03:03 - 00:28:33:16
Sara Gutterman: And then again, 15% of our audience tells us that they're in their the homes that they intend to be in forever. Here's some data about, you know, millennials who are looking to buy a home versus those who have purchased a home and how much they have to put down. I only point this out just because, you know, it's kind of clear that the older millennials and the ones that are more affluent have put a larger deposit down than the ones who are still saving for a home.

00:28:33:16 - 00:28:55:13
Sara Gutterman: And those are, you know, the ones still saving are still relegated to renting most often because of that student debt and the credit card debt that I talked about earlier. And, you know, probably not surprisingly, the frustrations, the home buying frustrations that millennials have echo, you know, the the larger audience, you know, larger home buying audience, which is everything's expensive.

00:28:55:13 - 00:29:19:20
Sara Gutterman: And, you know, they can't get into a home because they're getting outbid and things are moving too fast. That's, of course, moderating a little bit as we see the market cool off. But you can see the third response there is that they can't find anything sustainable enough. And again, that's a response that's growing. And then here is again that slide on the ideal home size that I referenced about 1500 to 2500ft².

00:29:19:21 - 00:29:56:18
Sara Gutterman: And then the next response is 800 to 1500. So again you know really this audience segment is looking for that compact square footage where you know, they're not they don't want the extra space to heat and cool, and they definitely, you know, don't want those McMansions. Now, I want to shift and talk a little bit about our revision House Austin project, because it was really indicative of all these trends that we're seeing in terms of, you know, what millennials tell us that they want.

00:29:56:19 - 00:30:26:08
Sara Gutterman: So we worked with a millennial who, you know, really wanted to purchase an energy efficient, healthy home, but really couldn't find one in the Austin area. What she did find was this house. And frankly, it's kind of a, you know, 90s, you know, odd architectural mishmash of styles. It's not clearly like the most. I mean, maybe this is just my esthetic, forgive me, but I don't.

00:30:26:08 - 00:30:47:17
Sara Gutterman: It's not the most beautiful home, but it suit her needs in that it had land, it had a horse barn. She takes care of rescue horses. So having that property was important. She has dogs, so she wanted to have some land for her dogs to roam. And it had a pool. And she really prioritizes a pool because she does a lot of entertaining and gathering with her friends.

00:30:47:17 - 00:31:23:01
Sara Gutterman: So she wasn't in love with the house. She purchased it anyway. And we we made lemonade out of out of this house. As you can see, the first thing well, actually the first thing we did was bring in who's going to talk in a minute to have him help us do an energy and healthy home assessment. But you can see while staying on the outside, we did put on an array of LG 350 watt neon to two solar modules to provide that resiliency and the reliability for her home.

00:31:23:01 - 00:31:50:17
Sara Gutterman: She also has an electric vehicle, but her very top priority. She is what is now being called a technician, and she loves to combine her passion for food with her appreciation of technology and innovation. And so it really fit well for us to work with LG's signature kitchen suite. And I'm going to call it ESCs because that's what they like to call it.

00:31:50:18 - 00:32:29:20
Sara Gutterman: And clearly I'm not able to articulate articulate signature very fluidly. Hopefully you're smiling at that. But SXSW really focuses on that technical audience. And they have appliances that really match that, that set of Mercury in, you know, aspirations, you know, in terms of having, you know, that gourmet cooking experience and combine that with leading edge technology to really provide flexibility and to prepare food and optimized ways.

00:32:29:20 - 00:33:04:22
Sara Gutterman: So to that end, we included an SKS 48 inch dual fuel Pro range with sous vide, which is a really interesting function that Tiana just thought was fantastic. We also had a 48 inch dual fuel ranges with a lot of versatility. It offers induction and ultra high and ultra low gas burners. We had a 40 inch, 48 inch range that has two ovens below and includes the ability to combine steam and convection cooking.

00:33:04:24 - 00:33:41:04
Sara Gutterman: We had an induction cooktop. We had 30 inch combination wall oven with steam feature and 30 inch integrated column refrigerator and freezer, which runs on an inverter compressor. There was artificial intelligence that switches these appliances into energy save mode at times. You know, when Tiana was less likely to open the fridge and also switch it to the vacation mode to save energy when she when she's traveling, which she does from work.

00:33:41:07 - 00:34:09:26
Sara Gutterman: We have these beautiful wine columns which you can see in the picture as well. And you know, so you can see we really tried to cater to to her aspiration for having this kind of gourmet kitchen in her home in a way that suit her lifestyle. We also did a butler's. We needed a butler's pantry into more of an entertainment and cooking area as well.

00:34:09:28 - 00:34:50:02
Sara Gutterman: Then also in the kitchen, we replaced what were pretty terrible, you know, antiquated countertops with low houses countertops. It's a courts line called Via Terra. It's a solid surface that's 93% natural quartz, which, you know, has advanced durability and higher tensile strength than other natural stone products. And, you know, it's non-porous and very hygienic. We also included this beautiful bocce contemporary step room sink that is made from 100% natural and recyclable products.

00:34:50:08 - 00:35:22:16
Sara Gutterman: We also use the bocce sinks in the bathrooms. The house also had literally probably about ten different kinds of flooring and all the different rooms. And so we replaced that with a whole suite of Mohawk products. We use Mohawks, ultra wood, which is a performance hardwood that is waterproof. It's long lasting and durable. And you know, you know, also it's it's very it's designed for optimized and streamlined installation.

00:35:22:19 - 00:35:54:10
Sara Gutterman: And so it's, you know, it's the installation was quick and easy and cleanup was easy as well. So, you know, it's also easy to clean. And you know, it's got that wet protect, you know, to protect the floor from dogs and kids and, you know, people coming in dripping wet from the pool. We also used Mohawks Pago Extreme in the bathroom and the butler's pantry, which is more affordable.

00:35:54:10 - 00:36:29:08
Sara Gutterman: And it's also, you know, dent proof, kid proof, pet proof, waterproof, as well as the Mohawks ever strand carpet, which is made with 100% post-consumer recycled content. It's got strong fiber and it's very easy to clean. So we were really happy with the Mohawk selections in the home. And you can see we kind of took it from Texas, you know, 90 style McMansion to something that was much sleeker and more beautiful, but also very comfortable in terms of the energy efficiency elements.

00:36:29:15 - 00:36:58:12
Sara Gutterman: We utilized sanctuary insulation by green fiber, which has a low embodied energy with respect to kind of all of the insulation choices. It's also made from 85% of post-consumer recycled plant fibers that lock in carbon for the life of the home. So it uses low energy manufacturing and as much as possible, short haul transportation. But it also effectively becomes a carbon sink.

00:36:58:15 - 00:37:30:26
Sara Gutterman: I think KR will talk a little bit more about that. And then we also swapped out their HBC system to incorporate an LG multi Max heat pump and a vertical air handling unit, which had zones so that we could keep the various different zones in house comfortable. She had a zone where she kept her dogs during the day when she was at work, and she wanted to keep that cooler for the dogs, to keep them comfortable than other portions of the home.

00:37:30:26 - 00:38:06:24
Sara Gutterman: And so the LG, HBC system, not only, you know, helped her create a more comfortable home, but of course also reduce energy bills to address indoor air quality, we incorporated an HP product central vacuum again, mostly because of the dogs. She has big dogs they shed all over, and you know, she really wanted to have that very easy to clean system for, you know, picking up dog hair and then also to have that in the kitchen.

00:38:06:24 - 00:38:43:19
Sara Gutterman: And so she's really happy with having that indoor the central axis and to keep her indoor air quality clean. And then she also because she does work, you know, away from the home some of the time and travel. She did want to be able to have a smart garage. So the Mike app from Lift Master enables her to do things like, you know, temporarily open a garage door if she's having a delivery or give the delivery code to the delivery person, which is a really cool functionality these days.

00:38:43:26 - 00:39:14:18
Sara Gutterman: And just to be able to have the built in Wi-Fi with smart home control with that mic app allows, you know, anyone. She needs to have that remote access. It gives her alerts and has the Amazon key functionality. And then last but certainly not least, we incorporated Hayward Pool products. So a variable speed pump, a smart hub controller, super powerful filter and robotic cleaner as well.

00:39:14:20 - 00:39:47:24
Sara Gutterman: And this was really just because, you know, as I said, Tianna really does a lot of entertaining with her friends and having a pool in Austin, especially given given the extreme temperature, that it was really important to her. So with that, I'm going to hand things over to KR to talk about, you know, really kind of not just this use case of the of the Austin project, but kind of executing the ideals, as he says, and implementing best practices for giving millennials what they want based on the data.

00:39:47:26 - 00:39:49:05
Sara Gutterman: So KR over.

00:39:49:05 - 00:40:18:07
KR: To you greeting. So I mean, given given the technical focus of the next generation, I am being hampered by a video camera technical expertise. So you're going to have to listen to me and look at slides and not see the honest, earnest expression I'm making as I talk. So one of the things that just pops out to me from the last 40 minutes of discussion around the data, around millennial purchasing power, is how much has changed based on that data.

00:40:18:07 - 00:40:52:14
KR: So I've been building zero energy homes for the last decade and watching these indices. And the reality of the market is that for five generations. The reason people buy phones has not significantly changed. And millennials are a massive inflection point in the subsequent generations are following suit, where the value systems that cause them to separate good from better from best, where they're buying best is has new metrics, metrics that we've ever seen before.

00:40:52:15 - 00:41:41:16
KR: And the challenge, therefore, for the people that are of earlier generations is to understand the things that made them successful. Building and executing and delivering homes to prior generations very successfully has taken a massive shift. And so as you look at the three major directives that millennials are embracing, that is much more significantly important. Their buying decision than others gets codified into this bucket of sustainability, this bucket of durability, and this bucket of climate change and carbon, right, that there's these thoughts that are new, that inform buyers about the way they think better is and the choices they have in the marketplace.

00:41:41:18 - 00:42:13:17
KR: So if you flip us to the next one, I want to do a quick, deep dive in how these value propositions inform both the buyer, but more importantly, need to get translated into business practices to realize the potential of capturing millennials as consumers. And more importantly, you know how to look at that not as a in addition to, but a shift in the way values are being aligned and delivered in the marketplace.

00:42:13:17 - 00:42:54:13
KR: And so sustainably. I think for some people in earlier generations or some people outside of sustainability, movement is is often thought of as, hey, we want to protect polar bears, hey, we want to protect future generations. And I perceive it as a much more pragmatic approach to delivering better that there's a value proposition to reduce wasted energy and uncontrolled energy, that not only does it reduce the operating and holding cost for properties, but it also improves the health and the comfort of homes that improve the living experience a better built, more thoughtfully design homes.

00:42:54:13 - 00:43:40:29
KR: And so sustainability isn't an external wish for the world to be a better place, but also a personal driven that they expect that their homes to perform better and live better than the houses their grandparents lived in. And that, you know, easily, as Sarah had talked about, is it in these projects, by taking major appliances, HVAC, major cooking appliances, water heating and implying a small increase in direct cost to replace them with much higher efficiencies that month after month, actually pay you to make those smarter decisions, but also having more control over things that waste your money when you're not in your home.

00:43:41:01 - 00:44:12:10
KR: There's a tremendous amount of cost keeping your furniture at a very comfortable temperature that if you can pre-heat or prequel prior to your returning after a day of work, or based on the way your quality of life lives, these smart controls can greatly reduce what is normally wasted in dumb switches and dumb controls. But those smart features also significantly enhance the usability of things like do I feel safe as I'm approaching my house through my lights, respond?

00:44:12:12 - 00:44:36:10
KR: Can I entertain more effectively? Can I interact any personal way with my house that connects me emotionally to one of the most significant emotional decisions people make in buying a material object, which is buying the home they live in, and they raise their family and they retreat to for recovering after a tough day. And so smart controls aren't about widgets.

00:44:36:10 - 00:45:05:18
KR: It's really about can we look at the data that Sarah is sharing with us and look at cost effective, value driven technologies that improve people's qualities of life? And there's no more larger indicator of that shift towards a different buying practice than what we've tracked with health, right? Health has become a differentiator that exceeds location in the way people buy homes, and we knew that would happen.

00:45:05:19 - 00:45:36:18
KR: Obviously, Covid 19 accelerated the adoption of buying practices that focus on differentiating healthier products, healthier environments in the marketplace. And the good news is that it's not difficult. It is not a $50,000 lift in the direct costs to build healthier homes. It's about thinking about a wider perspective of value considering box. When you source your paint, when you source your flooring.

00:45:36:19 - 00:46:24:29
KR: Looking for partners in your supply chain like Shaw that already build healthier raw materials, that you can simply direct your purchasing groups to select more consciously healthier, sustainable, reusable materials that add that value, which is becoming a driving decision maker, especially in millennials in younger groups. And then sustainability. Not only is it about getting more out of the functionality by reducing wasted energy and using efficient appliances to do the same work, it's about looking at cradle to cradle and cradle to cradle means how much energy and what costs to the society in chemical and pollution is it cost to create something?

00:46:24:29 - 00:46:52:02
KR: But also then what does it cost you to use that? And then at the life of end life of that material, whether it's a house or an appliance or a durable component in that house, what does that material get repurposed into? And it's really why I love the picture that's on the slide is so often sustainability can artificially feel like I need to do something about this external value proposition to help save dolphins in the way build my home.

00:46:52:02 - 00:47:28:02
KR: But what it really is, is being more thoughtful about the broad value proposition your consumers are evolving to make decisions on and making better choices. It's about instead of making a home that is difficult to heat and cool and difficult to maintain, and uses a tremendous amount of chemical products to operate and build. Is being thoughtful about locally sourcing materials, choosing supply partners that supply healthier materials, and aligning your purchasing and designs to create a broader value than just square footage.

00:47:28:04 - 00:47:31:04
KR: Sarah.

00:47:31:06 - 00:48:09:04
KR: The next big budget, in addition to sustainability, is resiliency, and a lot of times that falls clearly at the feet. And there's the picture describes, it falls at the feet of being adaptive to the changing marketplace, whether it's, you know, increased storm density in the Midwest, whether it's increased sea level along the coast, whether it's increased fire propensity in the West Coast, every market in the US and around the globe is facing adaptive challenges to operate in an environment that was different than it's been for the last 80 years.

00:48:09:05 - 00:48:39:20
KR: And so that APT is bigger. When you think about creating a value in a product like a home that is more usable and more flexible for buyers, as Sarah was talking about, millennials are not thinking about every seven years. They're moving and growing and exemplifying their career projection through bigger and bigger McMansions. They're trying to Bolton and develop community and living there forever home earlier in their life cycle.

00:48:39:20 - 00:49:05:08
KR: But that resiliency means that they need to have square footage that is a workout room in their 20s and is there, and is their nursery in their 30s, and is their teen space in their 40s, and is the and then becomes their hobby rooms back in their 50s when their kids move out and that that that the thoughtful architecture and the execution of the floor space.

00:49:05:10 - 00:49:33:19
KR: Right. We're already designing garages with the intention of insulating them and conditioning them, because as people move to ride shares and the density of vehicles become less and less per person in urban settings, in certain settings, walkable garages need to be adaptive. So it's not just about fireproofing, although it's about fireproofing. It's not just about considering the 100 year baseline flood elevation, although it's considering the 100 year place baseline flood elevation.

00:49:33:19 - 00:50:12:05
KR: It's also about looking at flex space and in in designing homes for changes of lifestyle in the same square footage. It's about understanding that that the single family paradigm for the 1960s is evolving so that there's more kids returning from college and living in dual adult residences. It's about people valuing their parents instead of putting them in in retirement homes, siting them in the family home to help with their own kids into and to create that that the nourishment that multi-generational living provides throughout the family.

00:50:12:05 - 00:50:59:23
KR: And having that continuity, that means you have to design resiliency more and more than just the materials we use to be resilient to changing environment to, but to be adaptive to the people that occupy those spaces and smart controls just as much as they're important in displacing wasted energy, they're also very underlying. And the ability to create an adaptive use case that that smart controls can help buyers get more out of their square footage and utilize their home in a broader value sense than having a dining room that is single purpose in use twice a year and may not fit the lifecycle needs and require people to move from one house to another based on

00:50:59:23 - 00:51:40:20
KR: their changing evolution needs. But resiliency always is not just about death, but about durable, right? Can we build with better materials? Can we be more thoughtful to think about the operating cost and the replacement cost? Our country for the last 40 years has been a very disposable economy, and the value propositions of millennials and everyone in the US is starting to learn about the cost, whether it's floating islands of plastic or just the constant replacement cost of poorly manufactured goods, and starting to make much better informed decisions to buy better repair instead of replace.

00:51:40:20 - 00:52:10:06
KR: And that absolutely is underscoring the data that Sarah is showing us about the broader value proposition consumers are thinking about when they buy homes. And then the last bucket is, you know, something that, from my perspective, I've been looking at as a building science for a while, which is how do we execute against the growing awareness about global climate change in a way that allows people to separate substance from marketing?

00:52:10:06 - 00:52:42:20
KR: And so, Sarah, if you go to the next slide, the, the, the big opportunity in something that I lean a lot on green builder media for is the alignment from the supply chain and understanding how suppliers manage and report through that supply chain. Embodied energy. So embodied energy means how much energy did it take to extract it from the ground, or to grow it or to mine it or to, you know, to produce that product?

00:52:42:21 - 00:53:03:13
KR: How much does a case to bring from where it's manufactured to where it's consumed, and then how much carbon does it take to use that? And so in the graph next to the bullet points, you kind of see how much broader you have to consider more than just energy efficiency and the operational carbon. Right. What does it take in kilowatts.

00:53:03:13 - 00:53:47:26
KR: But what is it looking like to acquire these materials. How long were those materials last? And then what do you do with that material when you're done with it. And so when whether or not it's as a builder, you're being called upon to be very transparent in ESG reporting, whether you're called upon to be transparent in the materials you use so that buyers can select, thoughtfully design and executed homes, the understanding of the carbon cost and the ability to offset that carbon cost is become a significant aspect in being that better builder, that better aligns with the value proposition of younger buyers, and that includes the efficiency.

00:53:47:27 - 00:54:19:03
KR: We've talked about understanding the embodied carbon of the materials you use and making careful selections. You know, when you look when we talked about the renewable home in Austin, one of the coolest things was the green fiber insulation. Not only when we did an analysis of the home was it very conventionally insulated and had the traditional failures and insulation around the gable ends, and events and spaces where unconditioned and conditioned space were directly joining?

00:54:19:03 - 00:54:54:03
KR: But by replacing that insulation with thoughtfully produced insulation that offset the carbon footprint of the insulation, it also reduced the carbon demand of that house for the rest of the life of that home. And so thoughtful supply chains like that not only significantly impact the operating costs. And you can see it in your monthly bills, but, you know, have the have the same, not better performance, but with much more thoughtful and therefore lower carbon intensity in producing that product.

00:54:54:04 - 00:55:24:25
KR: And, you know, that story is is exemplified in the use of renewable energy. So not only can we shift from coal fired power plants or gas fired power plants to renewable energy, but we also get to produce energy where it's consumed, because a tremendous amount of the energy produced in the United States is ineffectually utilized from the distribution, from the centralized energy production throughout its grid.

00:55:24:25 - 00:55:55:15
KR: And so when Sarah talks about millennials are not only looking for zero energy electric homes to be able to make their own energy on site, and to offset that, the coal fired or the petroleum source kilowatts. But the battery storage also allows you to produce that power and utilize it when the sun's not shining on some panels and avoid the significant and efficiency of the national grid and the loss of kilowatts as you distribute it through.

00:55:55:15 - 00:56:22:08
KR: So renewable energy and being thoughtful about not just how you produce it, but making good use of those kilowatts and storing those kilowatts instead of depending on the grid to bring you back kilowatts off off peak is a big piece of successfully creating a more thoughtful, broader envisioned value chain to the market. And one last slide, because I know we're about out of time and we've talked a lot about data.

00:56:22:11 - 00:56:46:03
KR: You know, one of the things I just really want to exemplify is, is revision House. Austin was a great example of not designing from new, but looking at the supply partners, challenging the fundamentals of what the normal waste looks like, and very thoughtfully adding value. Right. How can we make this home healthier? How can we use more durable materials?

00:56:46:03 - 00:57:10:21
KR: How can we improve the major consumptive efficiencies, like the HVAC system, in a way that you can repurpose, you know, a late 80s, early 90s home in a way that makes it much lower in operating costs, much lower carbon intensity for the next 150 years. And in a way that drives a tremendous amount of value to the users.

00:57:10:21 - 00:57:32:11
KR: And that's kind of my last slide, is I just as a builder and as a building scientist and somebody that has been in this for a decade and will be in it for another decade, I think the opportunity is to have a broader understanding of value. When people think about ESG, it's not an external social requirement about running business.

00:57:32:11 - 00:58:00:01
KR: It's about a business being thoughtful to understand what it's going to take to make that business itself sustain over time by anticipating the needs of the employees, by anticipating change in the marketplace, by anticipating new ways buyers go to the market, so that if you're successful today, you have the tools and the people and the resources to be a partner in the communities to continue being in the future.

00:58:00:01 - 00:58:25:06
KR: So, so much of what Sara shared is data isn't about here's a whole nother layer of saving polar bears we have to think about as homebuilders. It's about as homebuilders, we need to look at our buyers as smarter than they've ever been. And we have to be smarter in our supply chain, in our design, to deliver homes that encapsulate this water understanding of value.

00:58:25:06 - 00:58:50:29
KR: And the great news is at the bottom of all of this and everything we've talked about in the details, it's really about building a home that lasts longer, uses more durable products, costs less to operate, and keeps the occupants happier and healthier and more connected to your product. It's about being building better, and all of the things that we've talked about for the last hour isn't about some external sustainability ideal.

00:58:51:00 - 00:59:18:00
KR: It's about being smart enough and looking now at our consumers as much more sophisticated in us having to up our game to meet that need. We can't build a 1982 Chevy, whatever was building Chevy in 1982 and still expect to compete against Tesla. People have learned that they can get more in the marketplace, and those things can deliver higher quality of life.

00:59:18:00 - 00:59:40:24
KR: And the data we looked at last hour is a clear direction on. There's significant signposts around building healthier, building more energy efficient, being more thoughtful about the materials we've supplied to be a partner to our buyers that are growing up in a market where they can and should have better.

00:59:40:26 - 01:00:03:16
Sara Gutterman: Sarah Sierra, thank you so much. After how many years have we known each other? Almost two decades of knowing you. I still learn something new every time I hear you talk. So thank you. I know we're, you know, just over time, but maybe we can just take a question or two. Is that all right with you?

01:00:03:19 - 01:00:04:20
KR: Absolutely.

01:00:04:26 - 01:00:29:12
Sara Gutterman: Okay. And actually, the first question is going to come from me. Question that I have for you, obviously, as you know, you know, the revision house, Austin, we're using that as a kind of a use case today because, you know, it was a very, I would say, typical scenario where we had a millennial that had made a budget driven decision to buy an existing house.

01:00:29:19 - 01:00:59:01
Sara Gutterman: I wouldn't say it was absolutely her dream house with all of the, you know, products and features built in. She knew she wanted to do some upgrades. Again, like what we said earlier, she knew she wanted, you know, an energy efficient, healthy, resilient, solar powered, connected home that, you know, that really met some of her needs, like entertaining and cooking and, you know, having the the healthy home element because of her dogs and her allergies.

01:00:59:04 - 01:01:22:13
Sara Gutterman: And we couldn't do everything right. We couldn't go, you know, make this really the Tesla or the space shuttle of of, you know, green show homes. We had to really pick and choose what we did with this house because of, you know, budget reasons. And then the first thing we did when we agreed to work with Tianna was to bring you in to do an energy audit and really to help identify priorities.

01:01:22:13 - 01:02:02:15
Sara Gutterman: So can you talk a little bit about the experience of working with Tianna? Not so much as an individual, but really as kind of an example of, you know, a millennial that's on a budget that knows that they want the space shuttle but can really only afford the Camry. And you know, what? You how you worked with her and what you told her in terms of the priorities of, you know, to, to to make the house energy efficient and healthy and resilient, etc., and, you know, kind of paring down the full, you know, want list to the things that were really critical.

01:02:02:17 - 01:02:30:16
KR: Yeah. And I think the parallels that I learned from the revision house, Austin, you know, inform both, you know, adaptive reuse and how to build new in a pragmatic world where, you know, there is budgets like we do. I mean, right now, this market, the cost to build a house is stressing everybody's finances. And so you do have to be pragmatic in your process to sustainability and durability and carbon management.

01:02:30:17 - 01:03:04:23
KR: And so the first thing we did was was look for the largest offsets we could make per dollar. And it ends up being a very pragmatic decision of saying, okay, here's the 20 things that that cost kilowatts every year, whether it's the the poor insulation in the attic, whether it was the older HVAC system, you know, this particular house had a a retrofitted hot water recirculating on the hot water tank that ran 24 hours a day and literally heated the sub flooring up to about 85 degrees year out.

01:03:04:24 - 01:03:45:06
KR: And, you know, you know, probably cost them $300 a year heating up the ground. So there was a lot of very straightforward, off the shelf solutions that we understand from an energy model. When we go through and we test the the air tightness of the envelope, when we visually inspect the, the insulation in the attic, when we when we do tests to look at the competency of the windows, whether that's something called solar heat gain, which is part of low EAS or the you factor, we can say, hey, this is where the money will create the most value in health and comfort and operating cost reduction.

01:03:45:06 - 01:04:14:12
KR: And that's exactly what we did for the revision house is we did a full energy on it. We went and looked at every major appliance. We went and looked at all the windows. We did a blower door test, we did a visual inspection of the attic, and we found 50 things that were wrong. We we put them in order of impacts and then of cost, and we sorted how we could have the most impact in reducing the carbon footprint of the kilowatts for every dollar of change that would cost us.

01:04:14:12 - 01:04:38:06
KR: And then we ranked it in order, and we started at the bottom and we ran out of money. We had our scope of work. And I think that's a very pragmatic way to go about any deep retrofit and a very pragmatic way I go about building my homes is I want to make sure that I give every person at an entry level or a or a move up level the most house, the most health and the most comfort that they can afford per dollar.

01:04:38:13 - 01:05:02:26
KR: And you make decisions like a seer. 16 HVAC has more offsets per dollar than a year 22 and that's just because you're 16 is more in the center of the marketplace. They produce more of them. They they create more efficiencies. And, you know, I couldn't afford German super low, super well insulated windows because I just didn't they had pretty good windows in that house.

01:05:02:26 - 01:05:32:09
KR: And so to your point, I think any time that you're trying to address getting the most on a budget, the best thing you can do is partner in your market. Your utilities have energy auditors that you can reach out to, and they will do an assessment of all your major appliances and your windows in your house and let you know, here is the here's the things that are outdated, that cost you operating money, and here's an average budget to replace them.

01:05:32:09 - 01:05:39:12
KR: And you can make super pragmatic decisions about how to pay for that by reducing your utility.

01:05:39:15 - 01:06:11:28
Sara Gutterman: Wonderful. And then the last question, just because I know we're running over time here for Ukr is, you know, clearly we weren't able to get to full scale electrification on this project because of the budget reason. And I think it was an aspiration, but it wasn't realistic in this go round. But what would you recommend for the, you know, millennial homeowners and home buyers who want to go all electric, either in new construction or with retrofit?

01:06:11:29 - 01:06:17:23
Sara Gutterman: You know, what are what's the pathway to get there without absolutely breaking the bank?

01:06:17:25 - 01:06:43:13
KR: Yeah. The the first rule is it is very difficult to economically justify pulling out a working large scale appliance. And so the best thing to do is do your research, understand what the best value refrigerator is. Water heater is, dishwasher is clothes washer is, you know, for being energy efficient. And when it gets replaced upgrade to that next level.

01:06:43:13 - 01:07:08:03
KR: So major appliances you know when you think about embodied carbon throwing out something that works, it's usually hard to make the math work. But having a plan and doing the right thing when appliances need to be replaced is always going to be ROI positive in this marketplace, right? That there's always great opportunities. Spend a little bit more to significantly reduce your operating costs.

01:07:08:07 - 01:07:31:22
KR: The next piece is sweat equity, right? The big majority of things that we were able to upgrade in this house was sweat equity pieces like coming in, rehabbing the countertops to healthier, better countertops, rehabbing the insulation. Right. A lot of that is labor. And if you're on a fixed budget, there's a lot of content in Green Builder media and online to help you be aware of what you can do.

01:07:31:22 - 01:07:46:14
KR: And there's a lot of projects that can probably significantly improve the health and the comfort of your home that you're able to do with a little bit of education and a trip to your local Home Depot.

01:07:46:17 - 01:08:05:23
Sara Gutterman: KR thank you so much for your time today. Thank you everyone that's in attendance. You will receive an email within a couple of days with a link to the recording. So if you had to multitask during this and you want to go back and and see a piece of data or hear a piece of wisdom from KR, you will get that.

01:08:05:23 - 01:08:35:14
Sara Gutterman: Feel free to pass that link around to your friends and colleagues. Thank you again to LG, SCS, LG, HVAC, and solar LCS houses, Mohawk Lift, Master Green Fiber, THP products, and Hayward for your participation in the revision house. Austin, KR. Thank you as always for your insight and for working with us as an expert green builder and building scientist and just, you know, healthy home expert.

01:08:35:14 - 01:08:40:09
Sara Gutterman: And again, thanks for your time today.

01:08:40:11 - 01:08:41:19
Sara Gutterman: We'll see you next time.